Posted by Ian Riccaboni, Mon, February 13, 2012 03:55 PM | Comments: 45
Analysis, News, Opinion, Posts
$ 6.71 million dollars is a lot of money to a lot of people. For the Phillies, it is the approximate distance between their current payroll and them meeting the luxury tax threshold. There is no guarantee the Phils will spend this money between now and the end of the season in an attempt to bolster their roster, but there is every indication that they are still looking to plug holes.
Jayson Stark stated on Friday that the Rangers and Phillies are likely out of the Roy Oswalt sweepstakes despite the two World Series contenders being atop Little Roy’s list. While the $ 6.71 million available may not be enough to sign Oswalt, the Boston Globe’s Nick Cafardo postulated yesterday that it may be plenty to woo a free agent right-handed slugger.
Cafardo speculates that Vladimir Guerrero may be atop Charlie Manuel’s wish-list for a right-handed bat that can play the outfield. Vlad turned 37 last Thursday but had a productive season for Baltimore in 590 PA: .290/.317/.416 with 13 HRs. He can still occasionally crush pitching, but the problem with Guerrero, as illustrated in the 2010 World Series, is he has become a major defensive liability in the outfield. The Phillies outfield of John Mayberry Jr./Laynce Nix, Shane Victorino, and Hunter Pence adds plus defensive value, even when Nix plays, but the thought of Guerrero pinch hitting late in a game and then remaining a defensive replacement scares me more than his bat would scare opposing pitching.
The Phillies likely have one opening for an outfielder on their roster for which non-roster Spring Training invitees Lou Montanez, Juan Pierre, and Scott Podsednik will duke it out. Pierre and Podsednik appear to be the favorites for the slot and offer speed and minor defensive upgrades over Nix. On nights when Nix starts, Mayberry is a terrific right-handed power bat off of the bench. When The Big Piece returns, the righty-count expands to two: Mayberry and Ryan Howard‘s temporary replacement Ty Wigginton.
Do the Phillies need a righty bat? Probably not. Cafardo mentions Magglio Ordonez and Xavier Nady as other righties with pop who are still available. None of Guerrero, Ordonez, or Nady provide defensive value or speed; while all three would be cheap, the already cramped roster with better candidates makes these three names a pass for me.
What does Phillies Nation think about adding a cheap power threat for the bench before Spring Training?
.290.317.416 45 CommentsPosts: 643 Manny
Unnecessary. We need a utility infielder to take Mini-Mart’s spot on the roster. That’s all. As the season chugs along, we’ll see what issues need to be addressed… but so far a utility infielder to back up J-roll and Chase seems crucial (as much as I like Galvis, I’d hate us to use him as a backup at this point, considering he’s very young and it might stunt his development).
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 04:07 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 Rob
With that line, I’m not sure Vlad still qualifies as a slugger.
I’d rather take a shot on Manny.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 04:30 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 643 Manny
I’m flattered. Thanks, Rob.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 05:01 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 Joel
Not even for the veteran minimum, he is a distraction that young Kids like Brown, Mayberry, Worley, and Bastardo don’t need. The other guys can handle it I believe but the younger kids don’t need his antics in that clubhouse.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 05:33 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 phil
I for one am all about manny. he may be a shell of his former self but the dude can still get on base and i bet he could still put up serviceable slugging numbers. He is as professional of a hitter as they come and will come cheap. He is willing to take a minor league deal and he might be a huge push if we need his obp later on in the year after his 50 game suspension.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 04:30 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 561 The Original Chuck P
Unrelated… with the A’s signing Yoenis Cespedes, what are the odds that Beane would engage in discussions for Michael Taylor?
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 04:38 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 643 Manny
Interesting point. Seems like Taylor is even more blocked now with this move. I’d love to get him back despite his less-than-ideal performance in the A’s system.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 04:42 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 Joe
Blanton for Taylor!
Flag commentPosted: 04:45 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 delearyous
interesting point. i also like the proposition of bringing taylor back. although he hasn’t shown much in the big leagues, there is no sure thing in brown. why not bring in a little competition?
but that wasn’t how the blog closed. it asked do we we need a righty bat. the answer is yes. but the answer does not rely in an outfielder.
i think what the phillies need to rely on though, is a strong start to the season from big joe. if he comes through, he becomes very valuable in a trade situation to bring in that utility infielder who is a threat off the bench in late game situations. NL clubs live and die by the ability to double switch sometimes and i don’t trust mini-mart to pinch hit for them late in games
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 05:04 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 bacardipr05
Does this mean Rube will go after another 38+ year old that can barely field ? You know he will.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 05:07 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 Don M
Manny still facing a 50-game suspension this year ….. would return late-May ….. hopefully the same time as Howard
so we either don’t need him, because Howard would be back .. or holy hell can you imagine a lineup with Howard and Manny Ramirez additions -other teams would crap themselves
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 05:16 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 John
We need another bat period……..Utility infielder????? What are Micheal Martinez And Ty. Not to mention Polly can spell Chase if need be. We need to score runs! We need another Bat.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 05:32 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 Matthew
Because we don’t have enough aging players on the roster who’s SLG % have taken precipitous dips as they age beyond their prime. Also, we CLEARLY don’t have a ton of low OBP, feast or famine potential HR hitters on the bench either. These are great suggestions ::please note the egregious sarcasm I write this with:: When will people get over the obsession with “a little bit of pop”. The Phillies offense didn’t struggle as badly as everyone assumes (led the NL in runs the final 81 games last season). And when they slump, and slump badly, it’s not because they don’t hit HRs, it’s because that’s ALL THEY CAN DO. They can’t get on base (ESPECIALLY against above average pitching), THAT’S why they slump, not because they don’t have enough guys in their lineup “with some pop”.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 05:42 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 Max
How could anyone in their right mind want the Phils to even CONSIDER Manny? Aside from his clubhouse-poisoning history, there’s this: he’s still got a 50-game suspension to sit out, which means he wouldn’t even be available till late May. WTF.
Not.
An.
Option.
Posts: 0 TheDipsy
A right handed bat? You should have thought about that before signing Nix and Wigginton. The bench is set: Schneider, Thome, Nix, Wigginton, and Martinez (probably). This is a silly article.
The Dipsy
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 06:06 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 Jeff Dowder
If the goal is to become even older and even less athletic Vladimir Guerrero is definitely the way to go! If you think there’s even a remote chance he could actually field a position, try watching the 2010 WS again.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 07:22 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 George
Polanco, Ruiz, Pence, Mayberry, and Wigginton are all right handed and Victorino and Rollins both switch-hit. Yet the Phils still need righties and are targeting antique defensive liabilities, one of which is a clubhouse cancer who’ll immediately miss 50 games and might quit mid-season. Sounds like a moron sportswriter from Boston is smoking something. I suppose it’s possible Amaro is smoking the same stuff, though. If he is, the Phils are in deep doo-doo.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 07:55 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 1989 Lefty
I was just about to question who the heck this Boston sportswriter is, and ask how he knows anything about what the Phillies are doing, but it looks like George just covered it. So let me simply add that I don’t think this Cafardo guy knows anything except how to get publicity by getting his name on MLBTR.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 08:19 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 106 Ian Riccaboni
No sarcasm here – I’m glad you and George picked up on my subtle jab that Cafardo did not really do a particularly thorough job of investigating the Phillies situation. The only reason I posted it was because I thought it would make interesting discussion, but I think after about 2 seconds of considering it, it’s pretty clear that none of those guys are good fits for the Phils.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 10:17 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 1989 Lefty
It’s cool man. You carefully said that Cafardo was postulating, and speculating, I caught it.
And judging by the amount of comments it drew, you were right, it did make for an interesting discussion.
Flag commentPosted: 06:54 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 WOIII
First of all, I don’t remember the writer, nor the reporter mentioning Manny. He was a frigging disaster in TB, and his bat will have slowed. He doesnt hit for power, and hits .270 at his best. Would love to add Guerrero. He was much better the last two seasons than I thought he would be, he can still hit .285. His defense isn’t good, but he would be good for a clutch hit, or good spot start, and could be someone to carry the phils for a random stretch of the season. He would probably sign for 3 or 3.5. They have spent worse money than that. He could also be good for a DH in interleague, and god for bid….
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 09:39 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 chuck s
All of you clowns who have an iota of an idea that Vlad or that quitter Manny would be good for the Phils need to turn in all your Phils gear and go root for the Mets. After you become a Mets fan convince them to bring in these two dead weights on your team. Manny, christ sakes.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 09:55 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 BART SHART
We do not need a right handed bat, but I do like the suggestion of Joe Blanton for Michael Taylor, whom we could bring back to the Phillies. Of course, we would have to eat at least half of Blanton’s contract.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 11:03 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 mike
need a catcher that can hit for average
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 11:14 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 577 Brian Sr. of CO
Seriously? LOL Who? Keeping in mind that this “catcher that can hit for average” would replace Chooch behind the plate defensively. Put down the pipe dude.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 01:41 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 mike
id basically give blanton away and pay any amount of his contract that would open up some room for us and make him a decent priced option somewhere else…im sure somebody would be willing to pay him a few mil
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 11:16 PM on February 13, 2012Posts: 0 bacardipr05
How much of the contract would the Phils have to eat to make a Blanton trade? Anything above 5.5 million we might as well keep him. Does it make sense to trade him if we have to eat 7 mill only providing 1.5 million in salary relief at the same time possibly only getting a 2nd tier prospect in return. Trading Blanton is going to be a losing situation as we would have to eat a significant portion of his contract for even the possibility to be discussed. At what cross point would it even be worth it. No one wanted this guy when Rube tried to pull something last year and that was before his arm trouble. We would have to eat 75% of his salary and get a Jeltz in return for some GM to even think it.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 12:52 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 1 dmoney2f
I think we really need a right handed slugger..i would really love for us to find a way to get jose bautista..i know thats a longshot but if the phils could find a way to pull that off it would solidify our needs and a world series title…does anyone agree?
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 04:18 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 98 therookie300
While the thought of watching Bautista hit bombs at the Bank is awesome, I don’t think there would be any chance of that happening. The Jays are preparing for a serious run at that division soon. I don’t see them trading their premier offensive force.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 07:24 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 1415 Chuck A.
At the very top of the comments Manny says, “Unnecessary. We need a utility infielder to take Mini-Mart’s spot on the roster.”
Uhhhhhhh….excuse me…..but isn’t that what Wilson Valdez was??? Here we’re talking about 6.71 million to MAYBE go to another slugger….which is TOTALLY unnecessary…..and Valdez would have cost the Phils 930,000. Don’t know about you guys but aren’t the additions that were already made to the bench plus the upgraded bullpen (Valdez’ trade aside) good enough?? WTF do they need an aging Vlad or Manny Ramirez for anyway?
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 07:07 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 643 Manny
I think we’re in agreement Chuck. I also really like our bench… with the exception of Martinez. I, too, would’ve preferred Wilson instead.
I really think we need to replace him with a free agent utility infielder on a minor league deal (or major league worth equal or less than Valdez’ price tag of 930K). The rest of the bench is pretty damn good on paper..but Martinez sucks. Plain and simple.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 09:45 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 Don M
The amount of people that both Hate our bench…AND hate the idea of adding a Hall of Fame player (vladdy or manny) to pinch hit late in games, I often feel like no matter what moves this organization makes, the majority of fans will complain about it- If I could add either of those guys to my roster for under $3m or so, I would do it in a heartbeat
A team that struggled to have a consistent bat last year in the playoffs, and people wouldn’t consider two of the best hitters of the last few decades??
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 08:06 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 George
I’m one of the few who DON’T hate the revamped bench, nor do I hate the possibility of Pierre being added to it. There’s more than enough talent on the roster even if Martinez doesn’t hit much.
But I do hate the idea of signing any of these guys. They’re all just antique outfielders who happen to be right handed. Maybe they can still hit a little, but any of them could fall off a cliff production-wise. It doesn’t make sense to pay out a few million for a guy who might get a few pinch hits, can’t run if he does get on base, and can’t be trusted to catch or throw anything. In the case of Manny, you’d also have an attitude problem.
They may have been two of the best hitters of the last few decades, but this is 2012, not 1998.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 09:04 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 Dave
If they do anything, it should be for a utility infielder. Just read today that Blake DeWitt might be available. I for one, am not comfortable with Martinez being mentioned in any Phillies plans at the major league level.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 08:33 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 1415 Chuck A.
Don, I LOVE our bench. Obvious upgrades were made. I just can’t see why it’s necessary to add an expensive older player. If it were that cheap…..under 3M dollars…then MAYBE ok.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 08:36 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 zubzub
Please, please, please … Everyone … stop talking about Laynce Nix ! He is a .244 lifetime hitter who strikes out more than once every 4 ABs, cant run or throw. He is a lifetime bench player. He is Ross Gload’s replacement. He will NOT platoon in any way whatsoever with Mayberry.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 10:03 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 Don M
If used against RHP, Nix can definitely contribute… He’s a .253 avg, .747 OPS lifetime vs RHP and while neither of those numbers are going to tell you he’s an All Star- they should tell you that he’s a very nice option as a #7 hitter to give someone a breather (or with Mayberry playing 1b, etc) and Mayberry might have more power vs RHP but he also huts for a lower average sort it play out and see who helps you the most in each situation…… I don’t think it ever hurts to have puzzle-piece players fighting for playing time
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 10:51 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 Doug
Call the Mets, trade Blanton,Polanco, D. Brown, and 5 million cash to Mets for David Wright, starting pitcher, 3B, OF, saves 2 million this year and 16 million next year for mets and still have Brown for future. For phillies it will cost them the extra money under cap, However we would have Wright 2 years at 3B, theres the right hand power bat added to line up.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 10:08 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 Don M
That call would go like this… we would like to trade you Joe Blan-[Mets hang up phone]….
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 10:37 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 26 schmenkman
(we hope)
Flag commentPosted: 11:24 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 26 schmenkman
So for about the same money in 2012, and quite a bit more money in 2013, the Phillies:
1) get slight improvement at third.
- Wright’s defense has been terrible for years
- overall, he hasn’t been much better than Polanco over the last three years (or he’s been a little worse, according to FanGraphs)
- he missed as much time as Utley did last year with back issues
- he will be paid $15 million in 2012
- in 2013, either the Phillies pick up his $16 M option, or he becomes a free agent
2) You give up the one main hope of a good young (cheap) position player in Brown
3) You rely on two of Kendrick/Worley/Pineiro to take 35%-40% of your starts
Pass.
Flag commentPosted: 12:05 PM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 steve
crickets……crickets…….
really though lol
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 11:38 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 1415 Chuck A.
So far Doug has the award as the “Most Ridiculous Comment of the Day”.
And I’m kind of excited to have Laynce Nix on the roster. He, along with Ty Wigginton, should get some playing time and contribute nicely. How can anyone argue that Ruben hasn’t significantly upgraded the Phillies’ bench? The only spot that seems in question is the utility infielder. I guess they really see something in Mini-Mart that a lot of us aren’t seeing.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 11:24 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 0 steve
I definitely agree Chuck (with most ridiculous comment of the day) but more so about having Laynce Nix and Wiggington. They are great pickups that i think add some professional at bats to the bench and are both guys who at least a few years ago were disciplined hitters. The only logical explanation that I can think of for keeping Martinez over Valdez is speed. The team knows Vic-Rollins are no where near the base stealers they used to be, and despite not being as good a hitter off the bench Martinez is faster. If the phils happen to bring in Pierre as the extra outfielder id definitely rather swap Valdez back for Martinez.
Reply to this PostFlag commentPosted: 11:50 AM on February 14, 2012Posts: 1989 Lefty
The Valdez trade was tough for all his fans, I get that. I will miss his rocket arm. But I applaud RA Jr. for acquiring 26 year old Jeremy Horst. At some point he has to bring in some youthful guys that may be ready to make the jump soon.
He has invited a good mix of young guys and veterans that should make S.T. very competitive this year.
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2012 Phillies SalariesCharlie Manuel
$3 million
Cliff Lee
$21.5 million
Ryan Howard
$20 million
Roy Halladay
$20 million
Chase Utley
$15 million
Jonathan Papelbon
$11 million
Jimmy Rollins
$11 million
Cole Hamels
$9.5 million
Shane Victorino
$9.5 million
Joe Blanton
$8.5 million
Hunter Pence
$6.9 million
Placido Polanco
$6.25 million
Ty Wigginton
$4 million
Carlos Ruiz
$3.7 million
Jose Contreras
$2.5 million
Kyle Kendrick
$2.45 million
Jim Thome
$1.25 million
Laynce Nix
$1.15 million
Dontrelle Willis
$850,000
Brian Schneider
$800,000
John Mayberry
$414,000
Vance Worley
$405,000
Antonio Bastardo
$405,000
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